I cruise by the local ReStore occasionally to scope out any real wood items. I now have a conditioned space to do wood carving, and am outfitting it. I put the carving bench in there, and all the carving tools. But I want a desk in there (for my computer, etc.), Last week, I spotted a solid wood knotty oak desk that might've filled the bill, but today, I found a QSWO entry table marked down to $37.50! It's all white oak, and of course the legs have veneer on two sides, near as I can tell. Even the drawer bottoms are 3/8" QSWO! Now, to the questions. I'd like it to look nicer than it does now, and it needs some gluing back together. I'd rather not get into the hide glue pot...because that looks like how it was put together. You can see some scratches on the top, and it would appear that there was something on it for a long time, because it has some wear. I've never refinished wood. So, based on the pictures, what do you folks consider my best approach?
First thing I would try is to use some DNA or Lacquer thinner to see if that removes the finish. This will strip shellac or most nitrocellulose lacquers. I dip a course stripping pad in DNA or LT and use that to apply and lightly abrade the finish to remove the old finish. Note that DNA will definitely strip shellac but it will sometimes slowly dissolve lacquer too. LT will remove both. If that doesn't work you may have to use a chemical stripper to get the old finish off. Either way, after strippring, you can then decide next steps and whether you want to use a stain to enhance the grain and get a more uniform appearance. If most of the color comes off with lacquer thinner, they may have originially finished it with a tinted lacquer.
Note that if the ring on the left does not come off while stripping the finish, it is may have been caused by someone putting a steel can on the top when it was wet. You may have to use some oxalic acid to get rid of the ring. If you are sure that it is not veneer on the top, you may be able to sand it out.
As for repairing the joints, can you see any old glue residue? When you wet it, if it turns sort of sticky, it is hide glue. If not, you may need to completely take it apart to clean old glue off. If it is hide glue you can probably just put some more hide glue in the joint and clamp it together. Personally I usually try to make repairs like that with hide glue if I can. It is not necessary to use hot hide glue. Old Brown Glue or Titebond Liquid hide glue will work just fine.
--Nathan, TX. Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.
Lazyman, In looking at it prior to purchase, I was convinced that it is all QSWO except for the legs, since they look like QSWO on all four sides. It's definitely not veneer anywhere else. I'm quite pleased with finding this piece, I can tell you! I'm not keen on stripping the finish, TBH, just cleaning it up for use. I see glue residue, and it isn't any sort of casein type- pieces of wood would have separated at the joints. I'll try water in the morning.
Corelz, I don't have a scraper plane, but I do have scrapers.
You might just test with some DNA in a spot that is not visible and see if it looks like the finish comes off. If it does, it is probably shellac. On one table I refurbished, I simply used some DNA on a cloth as a cleaner which takes off a little of the top layer of shellac along with any grime that has become sort of embedded. Then, do some light sanding to smooth the surface and apply one or more coats of shellac. You can top it with paste wax.
If it looks like it is varnished, I would probably try something like Murphy's Oil to clean the surface and then simply apply a paste wax.
If it not shellac, lacquer or varnish, you could simply try applying tung oil, pure BLO (no varnish) or maybe Howards Feed and Wax, just to freshen the finish. Experiment on the back side of a leg or an inconspicuous spot to see how it looks.
--Nathan, TX. Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.
Glue is likely hide glue. Water and heat are your friend for taking it apart to clean the joints. Personally I would stick with it to reassemble it as well. It's reversibility is what makes it so good to work with.
It may have veneer on the legs, or could be Quadralinearly sawn. You should be able to look at the end of them to determine that.
Finish is likely Shellac based, so alcohol used in a hidden spot will tell you how easy cleaning the wood up would be, usually it is fairly easy. Bringing it down to bare wood will offer you the best redo, and you can more easily lock those joints together so they don't have that gapping.
A weekend and you could have a beautiful piece, plus once it's done you will look back at it as a fun process where you get a look back at older construction methods, and products, so learning will happen. Funnnnn. :-)
The above advice is excellent, but personally I'd be concerned about the failing joinery at the aprons. Dowels? I'd thing it wouldn't be too difficult to break down to individual pats/assemblies and rebuild/finish. Of course anything you do will take away some of the character.
I faced the same issues with an old family desk that had been repaired in everyday possible, right down to nailing everything. The owners didn't car so much about the "originality", they just wanted the desk to be presentable.
OK, my mistake on the legs. Quartersawn, yes, but solid. No rays and flakes on all four sides. I sanded the bottom of one of the legs.
Impervious to DNA, so some petroleum distillate is my guess. I'll go out and hit the top with DNA and see how it comes out. If it cleans up nicely, I may just put on a sheet of plexiglass or maybe tempered glass, though glass would cost more than the table.
Water dissolves the glue, so it's hide glue.
I'm not sure that I want to completely dismantle it. The gaps are big enough to dissolve the old glue with Q-Tips and water. It's going to sit against a wall with my desktop computer on it. I hope- I haven't checked it for clearance with a chair in front of it. Might not be ergonomic enough.
One nice thing about hide glue compared to PVA is that you do not have to completely remove it to get a good bond. New hide glue will adhere to old hide glue which is one reason it is preferred by antique furniture restorers. Just get as much of the grime that has accumulated in the joint off (DNA or MS may help) and you can often just squirt some more hide glue into the joint to re-secure it as long as the dowels are still tight enough. You could add some corner braces to strengthen the corner/apron joints if necessary.
If it is hide glue but not shellac or lacquer, but it looks like it is not just a basic boiled linseed oil type finish, it may be some sort of varnish made from pine resin as was done before the synthetic resins became used. If you do not want to strip off the old finish, I would probably just clean it and see if a paste wax will freshen it up enough for your purposes. I have never tried it but I have read that a dewaxed shellac can be applied over old varnish. I've used Howards feed and wax to revive really old finishes that I do not want to strip too but it is not my first choice as it can take a while to dry and it does not really replace missing finish.
--Nathan, TX. Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.
Well, I blew it apart, because in order to make a desk out of it I need to lower it 4" for ergonomic reasons. This in turn means a reduction of the drawers by the same 4". That will leave me drawers 2-1/2" deep, which is plenty. I could just leave the drawers out and move the stretcher to the bottom of the top. I'll have to consider it. Kind of nervous about what may appear to be butchery. 🤷♂️
Still flogging ideas. Up for consideration now is an adjustable keyboard and mouse tray that will stow underneath and deploy to the correct height. I'll have to go and scope one out. That leaves the table in as-built configuration except for "refinishing". The tray can be removed later if another desk comes available.
I'm looking at hide glue. Is this good enough? I'm averse to going the boiling glue pot direction, given how much I expect to ever do. As for a keyboard tray, those are prohibitively expensive. I'll just put the table on a pedestal and mount a plank on some drawer slides. #Cheapnis
Yes, I use Titebond liquid hide glue all of the time for simple repairs and I have even used it for entire builds too. The other liquid hide glue is Old Brown Glue.
Note that if the weather is on the cool side, it can become thick and gel-like. Just fill a cup with some hot water from the tap and submerge the bottle for a few minutes to re-liquefy it. Warming it a little like this can give you a longer open time and make it flow better even when its not cool. I actually keep my liquid hide glue in my shop fridge to extend its shelf life so when I want to use it I usually have to warm it up. After it sets, you can clean up squeeze out using water (I usually use warm water) with an abrasive pad. Just use a towel immediately afterwards to dry off the wood.
--Nathan, TX. Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.
Excellent! I'll get some tomorrow and start putting the table back together. I'll build a tray out of wood I have around, and use some of the full extension slides I have, as well. The table will go back together just like I bought it, except for the joints being tighter. I'll try some cleaning modes mentioned above before I get aggressive. I don't really want to make a restoration, TBH.
OK, here's the table with the top refinished. Used an oil soap and Lemon Pledge to remove the dulling film from everything but the top.
Sanded to 220 to remove scratches and the circular stain. Stained with Minwax Honey and Jacobean stains mixed 50/50. That got the right amount of dark and the tinge of red. Applied two coats of Minwax oil base semi-gloss varnish. I should have also bought satin varnish; that was probably a closer match to the rest of the table. If I get tired of it, I'll knock the sheen down a bit with some Scotch Brite once the varnish is good and cured.
I'm quite pleased with what I have, for $43 and change. Well, glue and stain and varnish probably bring it to ~$100.
One thing bad- I told my son not raise any dust while the varnish was drying. Then I hear the garage door (rollup) opening but got there too late to stop it. He didn't think that the inside of the garage door was dusty. 🙄
My "shop" is a small section of a two-car garage, and there is dust everywhere. Oh, well, it sanded out. It is sitting in my "carving area", which used to be the dining area. I laid 1/4" AC plywood down to protect the laminate floors. At least I have a small bit more room to do the big stuff with the carving bench out of the way of the table saw...and I have a conditioned space for carving, now. 😁
Like every picture I've ever seen, this photo does no justice to the figure.
One thing left to do would be to put some HDPE strips on the bottoms of the drawers so that they will slide better.
That dark spot on the left side about 1/3 from the bottom edge of the picture appears to be stain from manufacturing, as the table appears to had nothing but use and cleaning in its life. I didn't bother to take it all the way off, just did some smoothing.
Thanks, guys. My wife would prefer that it be left as bought. Can't help myself; I just couldn't leave it all loose-jointed. Kind of sad that I bought a 1/2 pint of hide glue and used maybe 10 cc of it, and may never use it again. I bought a "dresser" that is two drawers with the intent of cutting it up for a project. It is full dimensional lumber- the top and drawer fronts are 6/4 QSWO. I couldn't bring myself to cut it up though.
That looks great. You can put the hide glue in the fridge and keep it for quite a while. You just have to remember to dunk it in a cup of warm water before you use it. I use it just about any time I need to repair something. Even if the original was glued with PVA, since you have to get all of the PVA off anyway, I use hide glue because if the repair does not work out for some reason, the hide glue does not required you to completely remove it for the redo. It is also so easy to clean off any squeeze out.
--Nathan, TX. Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.
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